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I'm a bit surprised that this hasn't received any attention on the bOOards yet, especially from those who are more into Japanese wrestling
than myself.
Katsuyori Shibata gave IWGP champion Kazuchika Okada a shoot headbutt toward the end of their match last week. Following the match, Shibata collapsed
backstage and had temporary paralysis of his left side. He was rushed to the hospital and diagnosed with a subdural hematoma which is basically a
traumatic brain injury that results in bleeding between the brain and skull. Shibata underwent surgery and is expected to survive, but his career is
reportedly over.
Here's the headbutt:
Some are claiming this is a work (Dave Meltzer included), but most believe it's real and it is provoking conversation about the stiffness of
"strong style" wrestling. Even Nakamura, the self-proclaimed King of Strong Style, said:
�Lately exchanging dangerous moves has become a trend in Japanese wrestling. With serious injuries happening, it might have to change, and wrestlers
should look back and think about dangerous moves they do and the risks they take.�
Personally, I am all for pro wrestling as realistic as possible. I grew up when wrestling was treated by the wrestlers and promoters as a real sport
and everyone took great pains to maintain the illusion. It's why I am so lukewarm on the WWE which kind of shrugs its shoulders at realism.
Yet, for me the art of wrestling was making it look as real as possible while being as safe as possible. Making your kicks and punches look as legit
as possible while protecting your opponent from injury was the first thing they taught at wrestling school. Today, even in the American indies,
it's all about "laying it in" or "working tight". I think it's a dangerous trend and Shibata's injury was a result of that.
Unless the wrestlers change their style, it's likely we'll see more of the same.
[Edited on 4-19-2017 by CCharger]
"She was warned. She was given an explanation. Nevertheless, she persisted."
"The powers of the president to protect our country are very substantial and will not be questioned."
--- Stephen Miller, Trump senior White House advisor, Feb. 12, 2017
CamstunPWG187
Man of a Thousand Holds
Posts 1562
Registered 5-2-2010 Location Harbin, China Member Is Offline
Mood: Barbeque
posted on 4-19-2017 at 03:20 PM
....fuck me. That'll make me think about things next time I watch kingston/Hero Loser Leaves CZW
bopol
Showstopper
Posts 703
Registered 1-18-2013 Member Is Offline
Mood:
posted on 4-19-2017 at 09:09 PM
For me, if it looks like wrestlers are really getting hurt and/or really could get hurt badly, it takes away from my enjoyment because I start
worrying about the wrestlers instead of focusing on the match.
To me, they have to lay off the head and the neck. We know far too much about concussions and having Misawa die in the ring after a fairly normal
suplex makes it all unnecessary and too dangerous.
I only signed up so I can read the forum.
CCharger
The Great One
Posts 3381
Registered 7-21-2010 Member Is Offline
Mood: Obtuse
posted on 4-19-2017 at 09:21 PM
quote:Originally posted by bopol
For me, if it looks like wrestlers are really getting hurt and/or really could get hurt badly, it takes away from my enjoyment
Agreed. It used to be that a guy would throw a realistic looking kick or punch (but not connect) and the other guy would sell his ass off and make it
look devastating. Nowadays, guys almost fully connect on punches and kicks (and head butts) and FORCE the other guy to sell it. To me that takes away
from the artistry, the illusion, and the cooperation that makes a match great.
"She was warned. She was given an explanation. Nevertheless, she persisted."
"The powers of the president to protect our country are very substantial and will not be questioned."
--- Stephen Miller, Trump senior White House advisor, Feb. 12, 2017
GodEatGod
Man of a Thousand Holds
Posts 1188
Registered 1-14-2004 Location Monroe, LA Member Is Offline
Mood: Weird
posted on 4-19-2017 at 10:33 PM
Shibata's easily one of my favorite Japanese guys, if not my outright favorite. I'm bummed at the idea that he's done, but I
can't say it's surprising either. Even among Strong Style guys, Shibata's known for stiffness and intensity. Some of his battles for
the Neverweight championship, which is basically a 'guys who elbow each other in the face' title, were downright brutal.
Honestly, I thought Shibata might be a guy to take the NJPW title this year. To go from that to a forced retirement...it sucks.
I like stiff Strong Style, I do not deny, but there has to be some sort of balance between the two extremes to be found somewhere in there. Even in
MMA, the guy is at least trying to defend himself - a guy in a pro wrestling environment may be expected to just take the hit and suck it up. I admit
to feeling a certain amount of complicity, given that I'm a fan of the style.
"It is an impressively arrogant move to conclude that just because you don't like something, it is empirically not good. I don't like
Chinese food, but I don't write articles trying to prove it doesn't exist." - Tina Fey
janerd75
The Great One
Posts 3454
Registered 1-28-2013 Member Is Offline
Mood: 3 Naan Band
posted on 4-19-2017 at 11:03 PM
quote:Originally posted by GodEatGod
I admit to feeling a certain amount of complicity, given that I'm a fan of the style.
One of my great fears in the WWE is that Shinsuke might get lost in the moment and lay one in a pinch too close and legit knock somebody out. Hell,
Jinder the Human Steroid almost put Finn's lights out with that Naan Bomb forearm last week and he's lucky he was 'only'
mildly concussed.
My other fear is that one of these days it seems like the ladies are going to paralyze themselves pushing an envelope their bodies physically
can't keep up with and/or Nia's going to outright break someone when she gets gassed and sloppy.
...Bippity Boo and Skibbity Bop or whatever the fuck. - punkerhardcornette
BRAY WYATT'S SPOOKY DOOKY VARIETY HOUR - Illy P.
I expect a company that's basically a cluster of jock shitheads to act like a place that's run by a cluster of jock shitheads. - P. Foot,
Esq.
First 9
The Rowdy One
Posts 2302
Registered 1-22-2013 Member Is Offline
Mood: Doing the Emma Dance
posted on 4-19-2017 at 11:49 PM
Personally, I always saw Strong Style as the apex of stiff but safe wrestling. These guys train for this. They push it right to the edge where it
might look dangerous but it isn't suppoed to actually be. Anytime it crossed that line, it's no longer Strong Style. Basically what all
the big spots guys like the Hardyz and Duddleyz do. They wrestle a much more dangerous style but they do it because they've mastered it.
Sucks that this happened but wrestling is filled with these incidents and this particular instance you can blame it on Strong Style. Just like you can
blame other incidents on high flying action, hardcore wrestling, and even the insane WWE schedule.
AmericanNightmare
Turd Generation Superstar
Posts 11
Registered 7-2-2006 Location Lilburn, GA Member Is Offline
Mood: Spedoinkel!
posted on 4-20-2017 at 12:03 AM
Cyrus and Kevin Kelly discuss seeing the match and headbutt in person, as well as discovering Shibata on the floor backstage afterward on the most
recent Killing the Town podcast. It made me a little sick hearing them describe the sound the impact made.
I used to enjoy it when I looked like guys were really "laying it in", but now it detracts from my enjoyment when things look "too real" or guys
seem to be in imminent danger. I'm old.
Killing the Town is always excellent, by the way. It's moved from being my favorite wrestling podcast to being the show I most look forward to
overall. Lance Storm and Cyrus have great chemistry and obviously know the business. They don't shy away from any topics, either. They spoke
fairly frankly about the JBL/Mauro situation on the same episode.
I know you stole my Loverboy tape!
Count Zero
Man of a Thousand Holds
Posts 1994
Registered 1-29-2013 Location Canada East Member Is Offline
Mood: SuperHeroInTraining
posted on 4-20-2017 at 12:59 AM
I'm going to take a potentially unpopular position here, but hey. That's what the internets are for. Oh, but first, I gotta give
Five-Snowflakes to the term "Naan Bomb". That shit is a heart-attack waiting to happen, but oh-so-yummy. (There are 137 calories in 1 piece of
Indian Flatbread Naan. Calorie breakdown: 34% fat, 55% carbs, 11% protein.)
Okay, back to the matter at hand. Now that MMA is a legit enterprise, I'm all in favor of people watching it. What does that have to do with
anything? Let me expound, if I can do so properly. If you wanna watch people being "stiff" and landing punches, there's your venue. Dana
White & Friends have even tried to adopt some of the storytelling elements that used to be exclusive to Pro Grapps, albeit not as cartoonishly (if you
ignore Connor McGregor).
Professional Wrestling has given up on old-timey kayfabe, for the most part, and acknowledges that it is not "real fights", but instead an
"action-dramedy" with pre-determined results, containing real athleticism performed by individuals who are essentially stuntpeople
specializing in stage-combat. Occasional injuries because of highly-trained individuals performing complicated maneuvers and sadly landing on their
heads at the wrong time are part of most athletic endeavours. Despite that, the risk really SHOULD be as minimal as possible in a pro wrestling ring,
which is essentially a theatre-in-the-round style stage. If that makes the product "less realistic", I think one must remind oneself that it never
HAS been realistic or, at least, hasn't been since Lou Thesz & George Hackenschmidt were stretchin' bitches out. (Settle down Janerdvis,
I don't mean THOSE bitches.)
I'm all for the Jerry Lawler School Of Throwin' A Good-Looking Punch, but when it turns into legit knees inna face, I think it's
veering into the same niche that "garbage wrestling" used to occupy. Guys getting powerbombed through electrified plate glass wrapped in
poison-coated razorwire is a little-bit-more-than-a-little-bit bloodthirsty, and I think Strong Style can sometimes be a little bit too strong for its
own good. We're here to watch adults tell stories through simulated physical competition, right? Not kill each other for a seventy-five dollar
paycheck in the Elks' Club?
If the athletes involved weren't cornered into thinking "Hey, I have to break myself in half just to get a break in this biz", wouldn't
the biz be a better & more humane place?
...Hey, lookit me using all them writery-skillz I got a degree for. Huh. Fancy that. I'mma go see if Janerd posted any tiddies lately.
ETA: Proofreading is a hell of a thing, and when one starts it, one should remember to finish it before hitting post.
