DriftThroughTime
Showstopper 
Posts 996
Registered 4-25-2005 Location Boston Member Is Offline Mood: legendary
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| posted on 9-1-2009 at 03:11 PM |
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I really only watched for the US title match. FFed through almost everything else, even Jericho's match. It's too bad the main event was
so telegraphed, there was no reason to tune in to see what would happen.
2.0
Wii Friend Code: 7144 6060 6914 1180
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Mario Kart Wii Code: 2664-2519-5750 (I go by Benji)
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Fifth Horseman
Creepy Little Bastard
Posts 86
Registered 1-15-2006 Member Is Offline Mood:
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| posted on 9-1-2009 at 04:01 PM |
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Just random thoughts...
Why would Cody Rhodes let Orton RKO his dad? I could ALMOST understand it if his affiliation with Orton elevated him somehow, making the choice
between the two a business decision - but he and Dibiase are treated like sycophants. This isn't Ric, Tully, and Arn... they're nobodies.
I cannot remember the last meaningful match they've won, and they look weak as hell.
The US title match was good for what it was. Three heels vs. one face is something you don't see everyday. But the Miz needs to go back to
wearing pants - it was part of his schtick.
Phoenix/James was also good, though after the beating she took, I didn't think it was right for James to keep the belt after one DDT.
The DX skits were funny, but like the Rick said, wrong audience. And the "fingerpoke" skit bugged me, in that they implied that, yes, there is a
booker that controls the results. We all know that, but still...
The Chavo nonsense... Charlie Brown kicking his football thinks it's old and tired. It boggles my mind that they use about 40 minutes a show to
actual wrestle, and they waste any time at all on this.
Cena's interviews are bad. Pick a style and stick with it, in the SAME interview.
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Stu
Caledonian Crippler 
Posts 2342
Registered 5-17-2005 Location Glasgow, Scotland Member Is Offline Mood: Scottish
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| posted on 9-1-2009 at 05:11 PM |
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Michael Cole: A devastating MOOOOOOOOOOOVE....
Fucking Die, Cole. Just...die.
The TWO TIME bOOardie Award and Signed Bret Hart DVD Winner!
"Well, Jeff�s puddle throws up the Shocker, so I guess some things never change."
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Biff_Manly
Rated R Superstar 
Posts 332
Registered 6-16-2006 Member Is Offline Mood: Old School
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| posted on 9-1-2009 at 05:26 PM |
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The reason Cody didn't attack Randy is because the WWE wants us to think that Randy "I can't string together words to make a proper
sentence" Orton is some kind of super evil genius who is always thinking three steps ahead of the rest of us. That is why Cody didn't attack
him because then he would have had to face Orton and one of his insidious plans--like kicking Cody in the head.
Honestly the Randy Orton push continues to baffle me. Has there ever been a push like his in the history of wrestling? I could see if he was the son
of the owner or something but this is ridiculous. At least Cena does attract a certain fan base and sells merchandise. But Evil Genius Orton is just
really idiotic and not worth watching.
I fell asleep during the rest of the show so I have to watch it today before I can rate it.
"Walter: I can solve everything by making this gramophone have sex with time."
--SCSA's Fringe on Ice Holiday Spectacular.
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Frank Lloyd Wright
Rated R Superstar 
Posts 480
Registered 10-2-2007 Location Fallingwater Member Is Offline Mood: Megalomaniac
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| posted on 9-1-2009 at 05:29 PM |
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I wasn't sure until last night, but now I am totally convinced that God hates Chavo Guerrero.
Six Diva Battle Royal - Holy crap that was terrible. Jillian Hall looked as bad as I've ever seen her in a ring. If that match lasted 5
minutes, it was 5 minutes too long.
Is the WWE planning on pushing MVP or not? We have been getting so many mixed signals. They need to either run with it or just bury the guy
already.
Big Show vs. Mark Henry - The silence of the crowd tells you all you need to know about this match. You would have gotten more action watching two
pigs wallow in the mud.
Fatal Four Way - Best match of the night by far. Nice to see Kofi retain. It almost seemed a lock for Swagger to come out the winner. Loved the
Miz's tactics throughout the match. You knew either way it went, Carlito would be the one to take the pin.
Beth Phoenix vs Mickie James - meh
If you don't know why people hate John Cena, then that promo he gave before the ME should answer your question. That fake intensity he gives
off, just makes me want to puke.
Anytime you get a simultaneous beatdown of DX and Cena, it can never be considered a bad thing. I even like Orton taking out Dusty at the end.
Cody's reaction was one of the most ridiculous things I've ever seen.
Not a bad show - Final Score: 2.8
I have two ambitions in life: one is to drink every pub dry, the other is to sleep with every woman on earth -- Oliver Reed
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the goon
The Rowdy One
Posts 2385
Registered 3-13-2004 Location Charlotte, NC Member Is Offline Mood:
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| posted on 9-1-2009 at 05:42 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Biff_Manly
Honestly the Randy Orton push continues to baffle me. Has there ever been a push like his in the history of wrestling? I could see if he was the son
of the owner or something but this is ridiculous.
I 100% feel the same way and even posted a whole thread dedicated to that subject in the Retro forum a while back.
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blackdragon
The Great One 
Posts 3231
Registered 11-9-2003 Member Is Offline Mood: Awesome
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| posted on 9-1-2009 at 06:25 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Fifth Horseman
Just random thoughts...
Why would Cody Rhodes let Orton RKO his dad?
I know we're supposed to ignore continuity, but wasn't it a month ago Cody teased Ted about how much better the relationship between Cody
and Dusty was? I hope when my future son says we have a good relationship, it's not code for "I'm going to watch my gang leader beat the
shit out of you then feign surprise as if my gang leader doesn't have a history of beating up old people."
A ho fucks everybody. A bitch fucks everybody but you.
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Al Snown3d
rOOkie
Posts 36
Registered 7-8-2008 Location Portugal Member Is Offline Mood:
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| posted on 9-1-2009 at 09:04 PM |
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So Kofi retained the US title for the 628th time in 2 months and has yet to say a word on the mic. Great push.
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LuckyLopez
Reeks of WCW 
Posts 10308
Registered 2-13-2003 Location Boarding the Titanic Member Is OnlineMood: Dying
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| posted on 9-1-2009 at 09:30 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by blackdragon
I know we're supposed to ignore continuity, but wasn't it a month ago Cody teased Ted about how much better the relationship between Cody
and Dusty was? I hope when my future son says we have a good relationship, it's not code for "I'm going to watch my gang leader beat the
shit out of you then feign surprise as if my gang leader doesn't have a history of beating up old people."
That's not really a continuity error, though. Its just Cody being a lying douchebag.
I think that's the thing. I didn't understand ANY of the motivation behind that closing segment. What was the point in Dusty setting
Cena up? Did a 2-on-1 advantage for 15 seconds really make that big of a difference then if all 3 Legacy members had just jumped him in the back?
And why did Orton RKO Dusty? I guess that's the easiest to answer by saying he's just psychotic or was testing Cody's loyalty. But
then the problem is Cody. The fans were chanting his name and ready for a turn. Cody was on the brink of honest to God character development and
becoming someone to care about. But instead all that they did was further entrench Cody as exactly what he was. A mindless, heartless, largely
identity-less lackey. He wouldn't even stand up for his father.
Hell, if they had Cody go after Orton and Dibiase hold him back it would have made all the difference. Legacy doesn't split and Cody
doesn't turn face. But Cody is shown to be a man and his natural reaction was the natural reaction we'd all have. Next week Orton could
have talked him down and got him back on board, and Cody would be a fuller character because we know he's not REALLY fully on board and the only
reason he's in Legacy is because Dibiase was there to stop him last week. But now? Fuck Cody. If he turns face in a month you know what he
is? A fucking pussy who wouldn't stand up for his father. A lying, soulless douchebag who just broke away from the only identity he has. Fuck
him. WWE found the way to make me care LESS about Cody Rhodes.
quote:
Originally posted by Fifth Horseman
The DX skits were funny, but like the Rick said, wrong audience. And the "fingerpoke" skit bugged me, in that they implied that, yes, there is a
booker that controls the results. We all know that, but still...
They didn't REALLY imply that. I mean, yes, Nash WAS the booker who allowed that to happen. But if you just look at it from a pure kayfabe
sense nothing changes and that entire joke continues to work. Nash allowed himself to be pinned because there was no booker telling him what to do.
He's just a wrestler doing what he wants like all wrestlers do. Similarly getting on Dusty for Johnny B. Badd isn't really acknowledging
anything except that companies sometimes stick silly characters on guys. Now if they had said "Who could let David Arquette be champ?" THEN its
acknowledging a booker.
That being said I wouldn't have cared if they did because its 2009 and kayfabe is dead.
Besides I'm going to assume DX were mocking themselves in that skit with all the Nash stuff. That it was all subtle winks to the Europeon title
and lost smiles and how completely hypocritical they are to question the Fingerpoke of Doom. Because that makes me like DX and those segments more
and doesn't force me to view those segments as just Vince McMahon pissing on WCW a little more nearly a decade after it was dead, and even
taking a chance to piss on a wrestler who DARED to speak against WWE about drugs.
[Edited on 9-1-2009 by LuckyLopez]
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nsuking2005
Rated R Superstar
Posts 363
Registered 12-24-2007 Location Louisiana Member Is Offline Mood:
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| posted on 9-1-2009 at 10:42 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by atothej
I'm surprised nobody's really discussed the Mickie/Beth match, since I thought it was a notable standout on the show. For one, it was the
first time I've ever seen them click in-ring, and that was well overdue. Second, I was surprised that they busted out such a stiff-looking
style (and how well it worked). I know it's not up to Daffney/Hamda from TNA, but I thought it was a really good match.
More importantly, it was the only match/segment of the show that seemed to play up the submission focus of the next PPV. Makes me wonder if
we're getting a Divas title submission match at the PPV.
I'm not surprised. I enjoyed the women's match, but the average wrestling fan can't even put women's wrestling on their radar
if Trish isn't involved....and even then. Add that to the fact that, just like almost everything else that doesn't involve the main event
on RAW, the women get terribly inconsistent treatment. If WWE could constantly deliver weeks like this, people might start to care about the division
again, but they're so hot and cold on how they wanna use the women that it's hard to give a damn. Again, that pretty much puts them in the
same boat with everything else not involving Legacy, Jericho or DX.
I think, if WWE is planning on following up this week at all (something I'm not holding my breath for), they can go with Beth declaring that the
only reason Mickie was able to luck into a win was that Beth was tired from the Battle Royal earlier that night. And if this happens, it's
pretty much a given Trish will be having some kind of interaction to build to a match at BP since (I think) it's the Sunday after Trish is lined
up to guest host.
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LuckyLopez
Reeks of WCW
Posts 10308
Registered 2-13-2003 Location Boarding the Titanic Member Is OnlineMood: Dying
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| posted on 9-1-2009 at 11:53 PM |
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I don't know. I didn't think it was a terribly strong match. Not a bad one, mind you, and a lot better than what the two of them have
done in the past. But it felt a bit off to me and others confirmed that in chat. And at least in part I'm sure I was still a little hungover
from that HORRIBLE battle royal that really was a match worthy of calling "worst of the year" or whatever.
nsuking: Breaking Point is the Sunday before Trish's RAW. 12 days away and the Sunday after the Bob Barker RAW.
[Edited on 9-1-2009 by LuckyLopez]
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Stu
Caledonian Crippler
Posts 2342
Registered 5-17-2005 Location Glasgow, Scotland Member Is Offline Mood: Scottish
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| posted on 9-2-2009 at 12:13 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by LuckyLopez
That's not really a continuity error, though. Its just Cody being a lying douchebag.
I think that's the thing. I didn't understand ANY of the motivation behind that closing segment. What was the point in Dusty setting
Cena up? Did a 2-on-1 advantage for 15 seconds really make that big of a difference then if all 3 Legacy members had just jumped him in the back?
And why did Orton RKO Dusty? I guess that's the easiest to answer by saying he's just psychotic or was testing Cody's loyalty. But
then the problem is Cody. The fans were chanting his name and ready for a turn. Cody was on the brink of honest to God character development and
becoming someone to care about. But instead all that they did was further entrench Cody as exactly what he was. A mindless, heartless, largely
identity-less lackey. He wouldn't even stand up for his father.
Which is kinda weird from my point of view because Cody in fact already HAD a feud with Randy Orton over Randy attacking his dad, and he came through
that okay, didn't he? So from a common sense AND continuity perspective, why not stick up for Dusty? The only thing he'd have to lose is
his place in Legacy, and looking at his time so far in the group, he's not really gained a whole lot from that besides a tag title reign and an
enormous number of beatings from Orton's enemies.
The TWO TIME bOOardie Award and Signed Bret Hart DVD Winner!
"Well, Jeff�s puddle throws up the Shocker, so I guess some things never change."
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LuckyLopez
Reeks of WCW
Posts 10308
Registered 2-13-2003 Location Boarding the Titanic Member Is OnlineMood: Dying
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| posted on 9-2-2009 at 12:23 AM |
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See, again, I don't think that's a continuity or logic problem at all. All that means is that Cody changed and makes different decisions.
That's... human. It WOULD be character development if they acknowledged it. Just because Cody chose his father over Randy two years ago
doesn't mean he'd do it again. Especially since so much has changed. Cody was a WWE hopeful not even on the roster then. Now he's
a former tag champion who has worked PPVs and RAW main events and who holds a spot in Orton's Legacy. Its not like Orton was offering Cody a
spot in a non existent stable back then and he was making the same choice.
If you won't allow for Cody to react differently in 2009 then he did in 2007 (or whenever) then you're also basically saying not turn
makes any sense and no one can behave differently than they did years earlier.
The problem is that what it told us was that Cody's a douchebag with no heart or balls. Enough love for his father to be upset but not enough
to do something about it. That in the end Cody Rhodes is not a man. He's a lackey of Randy Orton who will do what he says even when it means
hurting his family. It was most likely intended to continue this idea none of us are buying that Randy is a Raven or Heyman or whatever type
character who controls people, but what it really did was bury Cody as nothing more than a lackey.
So its not a continuity problem or a logical flaw. Its just lame storytelling and another example of WHY WWE doesn't have new stars. Because
they put over the existing ones at the expense of the potentials.
[Edited on 9-1-2009 by LuckyLopez]
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the goon
The Rowdy One
Posts 2385
Registered 3-13-2004 Location Charlotte, NC Member Is Offline Mood:
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| posted on 9-2-2009 at 01:15 AM |
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I don't really get the problem with Cody not standing up for his father. This is pro wrestling and it seems one of it's many unspoken
rules is that family doesn't mean much. We've seen brothers turn on each other countless times, as well as stuff like David Flair turning
on Ric back in WCW. If anything, I thought it worked really well that Cody was angry and surprised by what Orton did, but in the end couldn't
bring himself to attack him (for whatever reason).
Plus this could set up a Ted Dibiase/Virgil type scenario for down the road, where Cody (and/or Ted Jr.) finally get fed up with Orton's shit
and turn against him.
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Quentil
And I am AWESOME
Posts 142
Registered 5-13-2003 Member Is Offline Mood:
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| posted on 9-2-2009 at 01:45 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by nOOb
Madden can also take a pretty decent chunk of time if you do 5 minute quarters.
I dunno man...Madden really hasn't been that good for awhile. I bought it last year and was especially dissapointed. I wound up picking up
Blitz 2 a few months later for like $10 and was far more satisfied.
However, your point remains valid.
Edit:
Oh, I should comment on RAW... Uh, I enjoyed the Dusty bits mostly. Sure I am a longtime wrestling nerd who used to love WCW, so I got the
'in-joke' and all...However, i'm still not going to go out and buy the damned DVD.
The Chavo/Swaggle thing just needs to end.
Uh, the Diva Royal was sloppy, as has been said. The setup to the ending especially so. The other woman's match was more acceptable, although
nothing as cool as I see on TNA on a weekly basis. Say what you want about TNA, but they are doing a really good take on their women's division
of late.
Lesse, main event was kind of dumb. If you can really call it a main event. The pointless smozz did remind me of the crappier endings to Nitro back
in the day, though. So maybe there was an unintended WCW vibe there? Or maybe not.
What else? Fatal 4-way was acceptable for TV. Nothing "holy shit" about it, but it wasn't meant to be. Jericho/MVP was pretty much the
same.
Overall, nothing great this week, but a couple funny skits.
Rating: 2.5
[Edited on 9-2-2009 by Quentil]
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LuckyLopez
Reeks of WCW
Posts 10308
Registered 2-13-2003 Location Boarding the Titanic Member Is OnlineMood: Dying
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| posted on 9-2-2009 at 02:19 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by the goon
I don't really get the problem with Cody not standing up for his father. This is pro wrestling and it seems one of it's many unspoken
rules is that family doesn't mean much. We've seen brothers turn on each other countless times, as well as stuff like David Flair turning
on Ric back in WCW. If anything, I thought it worked really well that Cody was angry and surprised by what Orton did, but in the end couldn't
bring himself to attack him (for whatever reason).
Plus this could set up a Ted Dibiase/Virgil type scenario for down the road, where Cody (and/or Ted Jr.) finally get fed up with Orton's shit
and turn against him.
When David Flair turned on Ric it was a heel turn. It was an underhanded and evil thing to do that he did for sex and money. He was a very bad guy.
When Matt Hardy turned on Jeff JR acted like he was the devil. So I'm not sure how you come to the conclusion that "family doesn't mean
much." WWE made a huge story of the Hardys just recently.
But its the "whatever reason" part that is the issue. Cody's motivation. If Cody had just taken it and not cared, he's an evil
sociopath. Problem is he DID care. He WAS angry and upset and became conflicted between his loyalty to Randy Orton and his father. And he chose
Randy. Which makes him a boot licking lackey. THAT was the set up for a face turn. By not turning face and staying with Legacy, but also making
clear that he WANTED to turn, he showed that he was unwilling to follow through and made a decision to be Randy's bitch.
If they DO turn Cody down the line? Fuck Cody. He's a fucking tool who didn't have the balls to fight Randy last night when he dropped
his father. If Cody decides he's sick of Randy in 3 months after a year of boot licking and THIS? Fuck him. He doesn't deserve a fan
response. And he's not getting any more over as a heel either. Last night he was portrayed as a coward and/or a willing bitch. That's
it. That doesn't change even if he turns on Randy next week. He was still a no balls having bitch this week.
[Edited on 9-2-2009 by LuckyLopez]
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nobledictator
And I am AWESOME
Posts 102
Registered 2-28-2005 Member Is Offline Mood:
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| posted on 9-2-2009 at 02:46 AM |
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You know you are right Lucky this was a very character defining moment for Cody....he was pure and simple a coward. WWE could totally milk that for
the next few years or so with Cody totally trying to redeem himself but everyone seeing him as a coward.
You could do alot with Cody at this moment I think. I think the most intereting he has been since he came to the WWE....its up to the WWE to utilize
it.
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the goon
The Rowdy One
Posts 2385
Registered 3-13-2004 Location Charlotte, NC Member Is Offline Mood:
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| posted on 9-2-2009 at 03:06 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by LuckyLopez
When David Flair turned on Ric it was a heel turn. It was an underhanded and evil thing to do that he did for sex and money. He was a very bad guy.
When Matt Hardy turned on Jeff JR acted like he was the devil. So I'm not sure how you come to the conclusion that "family doesn't mean
much." WWE made a huge story of the Hardys just recently.
I think you may have missed my point, Lucky. It just seems like everyone is more or less saying "How could Cody not stick up for his own father?"
and I was pointing out that in pro wrestling, family allegiance means nothing. Family members do horrible things to each other all the time in
wrestling (see the McMahons, Harts, Hardys, Steiners, or even fake brothers like Edge and Christian). Sure, Cody showed anger about what Orton did.
But the fact that he chose keeping his spot in Legacy over attacking Orton makes sense to me. You referenced David turning on Ric for the sex and
money, the same thing could possibly be said about Cody ultimately choosing Legacy over his own father (you know, assuming Legacy pulls in mad pussy
and cash for him). Your opinion is that Cody looks like a total bitch for not attacking Orton, my opinion is that it pissed Cody off, but in the long
run he'd rather stay in Legacy, and that makes sense.
quote:
Originally posted by LuckyLopez But its the "whatever reason" part that is the issue. Cody's motivation. If Cody had just
taken it and not cared, he's an evil sociopath. Problem is he DID care. He WAS angry and upset and became conflicted between his loyalty to
Randy Orton and his father. And he chose Randy. Which makes him a boot licking lackey. THAT was the set up for a face turn. By not turning face
and staying with Legacy, but also making clear that he WANTED to turn, he showed that he was unwilling to follow through and made a decision to be
Randy's bitch.
But he's been Orton's boot licking lackey for about a year, so what he did seems pretty consistent with that character. The world
wasn't demanding a Cody Rhodes face turn until that one moment last night (as compared to say, Batista's original face turn against Triple
H), so I just don't see it as a huge missed opportunity or anything. It was more just Cody staying in line as Orton's lackey.
quote:
Originally posted by LuckyLopez If they DO turn Cody down the line? Fuck Cody. He's a fucking tool who didn't have the
balls to fight Randy last night when he dropped his father. If Cody decides he's sick of Randy in 3 months after a year of boot licking and
THIS? Fuck him. He doesn't deserve a fan response. And he's not getting any more over as a heel either. Last night he was portrayed as
a coward and/or a willing bitch. That's it. That doesn't change even if he turns on Randy next week. He was still a no balls having
bitch this week.
Again, I disagree. I think writing off a future face turn for Cody because of one incident is a little silly. There have been tons of heels who have
done tons of cowardly/dastardly things and still transitioned into being a face just fine. Like I said in my last post, I see this as potentially step
one in a Cody (and/or Ted Jr.) face turn. In the coming months there can be other things that Orton does or asks him to do, which Cody can respond to
with more reluctance or defiance, finally setting up a full face turn.
And if anything, it's Cody Rhodes...don't we all agree he basically sucks, heel or face?
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Matte
radedar suprstr
Posts 197
Registered 12-16-2008 Member Is Offline Mood: Happy
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| posted on 9-2-2009 at 03:13 AM |
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Cody could slowly build the courage and anger to finally snap on Orton. A somewhat slow process over time, ending with the full face turn. Like Punk
did with his recent heel turn, being kind of shifty between the definite face/heel status. I'm sure cowardly heels have slowly built the courage
to turn face, why should Cody not be able to do this?
In the world of darkness there has to be a light.
Be that light and spread your love to the hopeless.
Make this a generation of peace and happiness.
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LuckyLopez
Reeks of WCW
Posts 10308
Registered 2-13-2003 Location Boarding the Titanic Member Is OnlineMood: Dying
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| posted on 9-2-2009 at 03:21 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by the goon
I think you may have missed my point, Lucky. It just seems like everyone is more or less saying "How could Cody not stick up for his own father?"
and I was pointing out that in pro wrestling, family allegiance means nothing. Family members do horrible things to each other all the time in
wrestling (see the McMahons, Harts, Hardys, Steiners, or even fake brothers like Edge and Christian). Sure, Cody showed anger about what Orton did.
But the fact that he chose keeping his spot in Legacy over attacking Orton makes sense to me. You referenced David turning on Ric for the sex and
money, the same thing could possibly be said about Cody ultimately choosing Legacy over his own father (you know, assuming Legacy pulls in mad pussy
and cash for him). Your opinion is that Cody looks like a total bitch for not attacking Orton, my opinion is that it pissed Cody off, but in the long
run he'd rather stay in Legacy, and that makes sense.
And I think you're missing my point. Its not about him not defending his father. Its about the clear message that he WANTED to defend his
father. If that wasn't the story they intended to tell than Cody fucked up. But it seems to be the one we all got in which case the story
there wasn't that he was greedy or power hungry or anything else. It was that he's a coward who wouldn't stand up and do what he
WANTED to do.
quote:
But he's been Orton's boot licking lackey for about a year, so what he did seems pretty consistent with that character. The world
wasn't demanding a Cody Rhodes face turn until that one moment last night (as compared to say, Batista's original face turn against Triple
H), so I just don't see it as a huge missed opportunity or anything. It was more just Cody staying in line as Orton's lackey.
I don't really care one way or another about Cody so lets be clear, I wasn't calling for a face turn either. But THAT was the sort of
thing that starts to make a star. THAT was the moment that a toothless lackey the fans don't care about has the arena chanting his name. THAT
is the potential start of a new top level face who mixes things up. Instead all it did was get used to put Orton over is Cody's Lord and
Savior. And it makes Cody look outright bad. Worse than he has looked because before he was just a bootlicker for whatever reason. Now he's a
bootlicker against his own emotions and desires.
If you want to assume he's reaping huge rewards we've never seen or been told about, I guess I can't stop you. I'm just going
by the story we got.
quote:
Again, I disagree. I think writing off a future face turn for Cody because of one incident is a little silly. There have been tons of heels who
have done tons of cowardly/dastardly things and still transitioned into being a face just fine. Like I said in my last post, I see this as potentially
step one in a Cody (and/or Ted Jr.) face turn. In the coming months there can be other things that Orton does or asks him to do, which Cody can
respond to with more reluctance or defiance, finally setting up a full face turn.
And I think its silly to ignore what was a pivotal moment for that character. Seriously, dude. The fans were chanting his name. If I had told you
that 2 hours later would you have possibly believed me? THAT was a MOMENT. The sort of moment WWE struggles to create these days. The sort of
moment that makes a star if handled right. And they just passed. And in the end that was a character decision. Last night Cody Rhodes not only gave
up a title shot (presumably, there was no real title shot but if you read between the lines Dusty probably would have made it real of Cody wanted it)
but betrayed his father and left him lying for Orton. So what worse could Randy do to the guy to warrant a face turn later? I mean, if Randy rapes
Cody's wife then I agree... Cody may get my sympathy. If Randy punts his infant child in the skull that would probably be worse. But you keep
mentioning how common family turns are and you seem to be ignoring how they're almost always huge dramatic character moments. This
wasn't. They fucked up and Cody looks like a tool because of it. Did he look like a tool the day before? Sure. So if you want to say "no
harm done to anyone who mattered", fine. But that was a missed chance right there and its one that did damage to a character. You clearly disagree
that it did any damage to Cody and I don't know how much more I could explain why I think it did. But Matt Hardy was the devil when he turned
on his brother Jeff. An evil, unscrupulous, remorseless, backstabbing asshole. Cody was a whining, cowardly, pussy standing in the corner making sad
faces and damn near looking like he was ready to clutch his daddy's boot like a blankie.
quote:
And if anything, it's Cody Rhodes...don't we all agree he basically sucks, heel or face?
I actually think he's fine if nothing special, but again, I don't think that's even an issue. If that was Tyler Reks I'd
still feel the same. That was a chance WWE blew. It was a chance they made ME care about a guy I didn't care about when the show started. It
was natural and logical. That it wasn't some big turn fans wanted for awhile is what made it so special. And they punted.
I won't care about Cody in a week and I won't cry about the missed chance. But today I'm just reacting to WWE having a chance to do
something compelling and opting against it.
EDIT: quote:
Originally posted by Matte
Cody could slowly build the courage and anger to finally snap on Orton. A somewhat slow process over time, ending with the full face turn. Like Punk
did with his recent heel turn, being kind of shifty between the definite face/heel status. I'm sure cowardly heels have slowly built the courage
to turn face, why should Cody not be able to do this?
The problem is that slowly becoming a heel means you're slowly turning bad and giving in to your negative traits. Slowly turning face and
getting courage means... what? You realize you basically just told the story of a 12-year-old boy getting the balls to stand up to a bully, right?
That's the problem. Faces are faces because they make the right decisions. Cody made the wrong decision there. WANTING to make it but not
having the balls to isn't teasing a face turn. Its teasing wetting your pants. I don't cheer for cowards and pussies.
[Edited on 9-2-2009 by LuckyLopez]
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Matte
radedar suprstr
Posts 197
Registered 12-16-2008 Member Is Offline Mood: Happy
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| posted on 9-2-2009 at 03:34 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by LuckyLopez
That's the problem. Faces are faces because they make the right decisions. Cody made the wrong decision there. WANTING to make it but not
having the balls to isn't teasing a face turn. Its teasing wetting your pants. I don't cheer for cowards and pussies.
It seems like if the fans in the audience see Cody's emotions toward Orton, they'll be wanting him to turn on Orton in their minds. Every
time Orton pushes Cody, these fans will be waiting and hoping for the turn, just to see Orton get pounded on by who would then be his former friend
and partner in crime. The way I see it, the typical WWE fans just want to see Orton get his, no matter how it happens for the most part. And once Cody
finally gets the balls to go after Orton, the fans will be on his side.
That's just my own personal view on it; the way I see the WWE audience reacting to this whole situation. Maybe you wouldn't cheer for Cody
in this situation, and maybe most of us here wouldn't, but I just see the "others" cheering for him.
In the world of darkness there has to be a light.
Be that light and spread your love to the hopeless.
Make this a generation of peace and happiness.
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LuckyLopez
Reeks of WCW
Posts 10308
Registered 2-13-2003 Location Boarding the Titanic Member Is OnlineMood: Dying
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| posted on 9-2-2009 at 03:59 AM |
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I have no idea. I'm really just speaking for myself. Others can disagree and probably do. Goon clearly does. I just don't see how Cody
is anything but a little coward joke after that. And if he turns in 2 months because Randy asked him to carry his belt or take a beating I'm
pretty sure I won't give a fuck and will just see Cody as a retard with fucked up priorities. And I don't think the right think to do for
a face turn is to say you don't love your daddy as much as _____.
The slow sort of "enough is enough" story people are suggesting is fine. Problem is that beating up your father should probably be a little closer
to the end, no? Its supposed to be an increase in abuse and sacrifice. So unless they escalate things it doesn't work for me. And even if
they do escalate things the story is still "You can beat the crud out of my elderly father but I won't stand for _____."
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gobbledygooker
The Rowdy One
Posts 2873
Registered 12-17-2002 Location Charlotte, NC Member Is Offline Mood: Yeager
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| posted on 9-2-2009 at 03:59 AM |
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I'd like to give this ep of Raw a -25.0 due to the fact that it has spawned this much discussion about Cody fucking Rhodes.
Originally posted by punkerhardcore -
"Seriously, Rock Band > Guitar Hero. Guitar Hero is like the cute girl who makes out with you for the first time, which is awesome because it's
new and exciting. Then Rock Band comes along and is like the chick who blows you your junior year of high school... and then that first girl just
doesn't look quite so fun anymore."
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Shannon Soze
rOOkie
Posts 23
Registered 6-14-2009 Member Is Offline Mood: forgiving.
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| posted on 9-2-2009 at 04:06 AM |
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RAW missed a stellar opportunity...one of those unexpected things that should have been capitalized on... and they blew it. For good. We won't
see Dusty Rhodes again, and I doubt that Goldust (Cody's brother Dustin, for the uninitiated) will come to RAW frpm ECW to get the revenge that
Cody passed on. So it's gonna get swept under the rug like nothing's happened.
Cody missed his Batista moment. So what if he would have got kicked out of Legacy. There's a logical replacement in Carlito. He may not
"look" the part, but Carlito can go. And a new star is born, with feuds ready with him versus Carlito, Dibiase, and eventually Orton, once the
belt's off of him.
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the goon
The Rowdy One
Posts 2385
Registered 3-13-2004 Location Charlotte, NC Member Is Offline Mood:
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| posted on 9-2-2009 at 04:16 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by LuckyLopez
I have no idea. I'm really just speaking for myself. Others can disagree and probably do. Goon clearly does. I just don't see how Cody
is anything but a little coward joke after that. And if he turns in 2 months because Randy asked him to carry his belt or take a beating I'm
pretty sure I won't give a fuck and will just see Cody as a retard with fucked up priorities. And I don't think the right think to do for
a face turn is to say you don't love your daddy as much as _____.
The slow sort of "enough is enough" story people are suggesting is fine. Problem is that beating up your father should probably be a little closer
to the end, no? Its supposed to be an increase in abuse and sacrifice. So unless they escalate things it doesn't work for me. And even if
they do escalate things the story is still "You can beat the crud out of my elderly father but I won't stand for _____."
I had a whole "quote for quote" rebuttal in progress, but this thread is just moving too fast, dammit!
I'll just say that I don't see what the problem is with Cody being portrayed as a coward with no balls (and I don't think it has any
significance whatsoever to a future face turn). The other thing is that the WWE had no way of knowing that the crowd would suddenly get behind Cody
Rhodes for two minutes. If anything, their thinking was probably "This will make Orton look like more of an evil badass!" rather than "This is
going to make the crowd chant Cody's name." Now, if the crowd had been chanting Cody's name for the last two months prior to this and
they still weren't turning him face? Then I'd agree. But I can't see this as some big missed opportunity when the WWE probably had
no idea Cody would get that kind of reaction, because there has certainly been nothing in the last year to indicate he would (and it's not like
they could have done some impromptu face turn or anything).
And I will agree with you that the attacking of one's father should be closer to the end of a heel's face turn. But this is WWE writing,
so I guess it's the first step.
EDIT: We appeared to be posting at the same time, but I just wanted to respond to this:
quote:
Originally posted by Shannon Soze Cody missed his Batista moment.
Going back to what I said in a previous post, Batista's groundswell of support happened slowly and naturally and thus the WWE had time to nicely
play things out for his full face turn. Cody Rhodes had one night of sudden crowd support (after absolutely zero face pops in the last year) in a
storyline that was never meant to turn him face in the first place, but could possibly lay the groundwork for it in the future.
Again, if the crowd had been getting behind Cody for the last two months and the WWE still failed to turn him face after last night, I'd agree
they fucked up.
[Edited on 9-2-2009 by the goon]
My fake (but real!) band's MySpace
My solo project on MySpace, covering music from old NES games
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