Matte
"Family Man" 
Posts 4481
Registered 12-16-2008 Member Is Offline Mood: #HEEL
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| posted on 8-15-2011 at 11:39 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Matte
A lot of those posts are basically extended versions of "this show did not interest me, and here's why" though.
quote:
Originally
posted by DKBroiler
I have to disagree Matte. I've been around these parts for a long time and while I've seen plenty of wars (shit I started here as 2nd
place Jackass of the year from a 4 month feud with Lucky Lopez) this one is a bit different. This one can only be described as polorizing.
Usually there are 20% who hate on everything, 20% who like everything and 60% down the middle. A guy like Chrisisgood is an example. Sometimes he
hates, sometimes he cheers but usually he formulates an opinion somewhere in the middle area after taking both sides into the equation. This thread
however seems to be almost 50/50 exactly. Either you loved it or hated it, and I'm good with that because regardless we are talking and
therefore it must have been at least interesting.
I wasn't sure what you were disagreeing with until the last sentence. I guess I get what you're saying, though. We're all discussing
whether we enjoyed or didn't enjoy the show because we were all interested in how the show would go down. But this was BEFORE the show went
down, and AFTER it went down, we all came here to talk about it. I wouldn't say the ones who hated the show were still interested in the show,
at least not directly. They were interested before their expectations were crushed. After that, they were just pissed and airing their grievances.
"I'm a professional. I know exactly what I'm doing." - Jeff Hardy
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mooseheadjack
Posts 9717
Registered 5-13-2002 Location Making a list..... Member Is Offline Mood: naughty? nice?
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| posted on 8-15-2011 at 11:40 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Firebreaker Chip
Also to the person (I think Moosehead Jack, sorry if it was not you) who said that a victory over Trips meant nothing is clearly out to lunch. HHH is
a huge commodity still in the wrestling world and he can still go. Sure you may find him boring, but come on his name still carries a lot of weight
and can be the big move for Punk. I mean Bret Hart was 40 years old when he made Stone Cold and Triple H is only 42 now for this world.
It was me. And I still don't think it is a big deal at all. HHH has had, what, one match in the last year and a half? For all intents and
purposes he is a retired guy now. He is getting by on name alone. Punk beating him means.......what? That Punk got a win over an aging wrestler who
used to be one of the top names in wrestling? So what? That has nothing to do with building the WWE now. Punk doesn't NEED a win over HHH to
be credible, he needs a lengthy run and wins over guys who actually matter now. Cena, Orton, Christian (I guess) ADR (since they insist on pushing
him). Beating HHH in 2003 meant something. Beating HHH in 2011 doesn't mean anything. It is like beating Taker now (unless it is WM since the
WWE insists on pushing the ridiculous streak) it doesn't MEAN anything because these guys barely wrestle anymore. They are relevant in name
recognition alone and contribute nothing at all to the product anymore.
- The History of the OOWF: Archives at: www.oowfwrestling.com
- And Moose, seriously, shut the fuck up. - DSop
- Fuck you Moose. The worst part about it is that you are right. I fucking hate when you're right. - Metallikid
- 2008 World Series Champions Philadelphia Phillies
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Firebreaker Chip
Showstopper 
Posts 881
Registered 1-21-2004 Location WCW Special Forces Member Is Offline Mood: Wolveriffic
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| posted on 8-16-2011 at 12:11 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by mooseheadjack
quote:
Originally posted by Firebreaker Chip
Also to the person (I think Moosehead Jack, sorry if it was not you) who said that a victory over Trips meant nothing is clearly out to lunch. HHH is
a huge commodity still in the wrestling world and he can still go. Sure you may find him boring, but come on his name still carries a lot of weight
and can be the big move for Punk. I mean Bret Hart was 40 years old when he made Stone Cold and Triple H is only 42 now for this world.
It was me. And I still don't think it is a big deal at all. HHH has had, what, one match in the last year and a half? For all intents and
purposes he is a retired guy now. He is getting by on name alone. Punk beating him means.......what? That Punk got a win over an aging wrestler who
used to be one of the top names in wrestling? So what? That has nothing to do with building the WWE now. Punk doesn't NEED a win over HHH to
be credible, he needs a lengthy run and wins over guys who actually matter now. Cena, Orton, Christian (I guess) ADR (since they insist on pushing
him). Beating HHH in 2003 meant something. Beating HHH in 2011 doesn't mean anything. It is like beating Taker now (unless it is WM since the
WWE insists on pushing the ridiculous streak) it doesn't MEAN anything because these guys barely wrestle anymore. They are relevant in name
recognition alone and contribute nothing at all to the product anymore.
Isnt that the difference between wrestling and actual sports? The name carries more weight than actual ability in the latter years. Triple H is being
treated as a special attraction that only wrestles when he feels he is achieving something that he has not achieved yet. Therefore when he comes out
of retirement to face CM Punk to shut him up. It becomes a big deal. Yes dont get me wrong CM Punk absolutely would have to win that match CLEAN. But
the point of the match is to get people to watch CM Punk and push him to that next echelon of superstars. Trips coming out of retirement to face
someone alerts the fans that something is up. Then the subsequent win solidifies that this company believes in CM Punk and if they believe that means
the fans are all the more likely to see Punk has a huge star as opposed to just another main eventer.
Isnt one of our biggest worries that HHH is coming out tonight to bury Punk and shunt him down to feud with Bourne (I saw someone else post this)? We
have every reason to believe this because Trips' track record and WWE's inability to consistently push someone besides Cena and Ortion
(Hello, Miz). However are you telling me that if Punk beat HHH clean at WM in the semi-main event that you would still be worried about mid-card
burial? Because I sure would not be! I would thinking Punk is made and has a long period of main events ahead of him. Isnt that what a hot feud and
match supposed to do. That is to make you believe that this wrestler is a true main eventer that the company believes in and that we can believe in
because the WWE has effaced the uncertainty of the future by solidifying their status as one their super-duper stars.
Then again, maybe you feel differently, but I think HHH/Punk at WM is the right play. After all Punk squashed Del Rio in less than 5 minutes last
Monday and I dont feel like he is anymore of a main eventer.
Steiner Brothers vs Sting & Lex Luger
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The Abominable Vegetable
Creepy Little Bastard
Posts 95
Registered 11-20-2007 Member Is Offline Mood: Sharky
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| posted on 8-16-2011 at 01:12 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by mooseheadjack
quote:
Originally posted by desjr001
I think some of you loons need to go re-read this topic...
http://www.oowrestling.com/OOForums/viewthread.php?tid=25391
but here's the take-away..."Punk tells the smarks to stop being bitter and just enjoy the ride."
So what part of that statement do you not understand?
So, because Punk tells us to just enjoy what we think is crap, we should just shut our mouths, fall in line, and blindly enjoy it?
Punk's said he's got more input nowadays. For all we know, at least part of what went down at the end of the match could have been his
idea.
quote:
Originally posted by mooseheadjack
It was me. And I still don't think it is a big deal at all. HHH has had, what, one match in the last year and a half? For all intents and
purposes he is a retired guy now. He is getting by on name alone. Punk beating him means.......what? That Punk got a win over an aging wrestler who
used to be one of the top names in wrestling? So what? That has nothing to do with building the WWE now. Punk doesn't NEED a win over HHH to
be credible, he needs a lengthy run and wins over guys who actually matter now. Cena, Orton, Christian (I guess) ADR (since they insist on pushing
him). Beating HHH in 2003 meant something. Beating HHH in 2011 doesn't mean anything. It is like beating Taker now (unless it is WM since the
WWE insists on pushing the ridiculous streak) it doesn't MEAN anything because these guys barely wrestle anymore. They are relevant in name
recognition alone and contribute nothing at all to the product anymore.
I'd have to agree with Firebreaker. You're confusing pro wrestling with actual sports.
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mooseheadjack
Posts 9717
Registered 5-13-2002 Location Making a list..... Member Is Offline Mood: naughty? nice?
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| posted on 8-16-2011 at 01:18 AM |
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no I can distinguish between the two. I also get that they will build it as a big deal that he beats HHH because of what HHH used to be. I also get
that, to me, beating a washed up has been is pretty much pointless anymore.
- The History of the OOWF: Archives at: www.oowfwrestling.com
- And Moose, seriously, shut the fuck up. - DSop
- Fuck you Moose. The worst part about it is that you are right. I fucking hate when you're right. - Metallikid
- 2008 World Series Champions Philadelphia Phillies
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Dominator
And I am AWESOME
Posts 150
Registered 7-5-2007 Location Florida Member Is Offline Mood: Cheeky
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| posted on 8-16-2011 at 02:41 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Firebreaker Chip
I browsed most of the responses to this thread and expectedly the fighting was over the finish and post-match booking. However, am I the only one that
thought the main event match itself not only underwhelmed it actually sucked. The extended restholds in the beginning told no story and did not figure
into the story at all. They relied on the hot crowd to carry the match, just friggin lazy storytelling. The middle portion of the match was tepid with
no connections between moves and lack of selling. The submission chain was the best part of the match.
Dude, what match did you watch? Guys were barely getting 1-counts on early pinfalls. HHH was out of position and didn't even start a count
once and Cena bitched at him for it, hinting at both possible bias and/or possible incompetence on Hunter's part. The sequence where Cena went
for his Three Wacky Tackles, but ate a high knee on the second one, only to restart the Tackles and transition into a Blue Thunder Powerbomb which
Punk rolled through via snap mare sending Cena to the ropes where he ate a high knee before reversing a follow-up bulldog back into the BTP again, was
smooth as freakin' silk. The submission chain was equally extraordinary. The point at the end where BOTH men might've injured their
knees within about 30 seconds of each other played in. Was it a foreign-object-laced spotfest like Orton/Christian was? No. But lazy? Tepid?
Wrestling is viewed as an art form in Japan and that match, save the schmozzed finish, was reason why. And as far as the early restholds,
that's when you're supposed to do them. No have three minutes of high intensity action then a 90-second Ortonlock. Great matches build
towards a climax. They don't peak and valley. You remember the spots, hence the name, in a spotfest, but a great match doesn't have
lulls. This one didn't.
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Firebreaker Chip
Showstopper
Posts 881
Registered 1-21-2004 Location WCW Special Forces Member Is Offline Mood: Wolveriffic
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| posted on 8-16-2011 at 03:41 AM |
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To MHJ first, I will agree to disagree. I think a lengthy build to a Punk/Trips showdown will cement Punk status as a main eventer in the WWE because
of HHH's special attraction status.
quote:
Originally posted by Dominator
quote:
Originally posted by Firebreaker Chip
I browsed most of the responses to this thread and expectedly the fighting was over the finish and post-match booking. However, am I the only one that
thought the main event match itself not only underwhelmed it actually sucked. The extended restholds in the beginning told no story and did not figure
into the story at all. They relied on the hot crowd to carry the match, just friggin lazy storytelling. The middle portion of the match was tepid with
no connections between moves and lack of selling. The submission chain was the best part of the match.
Dude, what match did you watch? Guys were barely getting 1-counts on early pinfalls. HHH was out of position and didn't even start a count
once and Cena bitched at him for it, hinting at both possible bias and/or possible incompetence on Hunter's part. The sequence where Cena went
for his Three Wacky Tackles, but ate a high knee on the second one, only to restart the Tackles and transition into a Blue Thunder Powerbomb which
Punk rolled through via snap mare sending Cena to the ropes where he ate a high knee before reversing a follow-up bulldog back into the BTP again, was
smooth as freakin' silk. The submission chain was equally extraordinary. The point at the end where BOTH men might've injured their
knees within about 30 seconds of each other played in. Was it a foreign-object-laced spotfest like Orton/Christian was? No. But lazy? Tepid?
Wrestling is viewed as an art form in Japan and that match, save the schmozzed finish, was reason why. And as far as the early restholds,
that's when you're supposed to do them. No have three minutes of high intensity action then a 90-second Ortonlock. Great matches build
towards a climax. They don't peak and valley. You remember the spots, hence the name, in a spotfest, but a great match doesn't have
lulls. This one didn't.
Brutha, I am glad you liked the All-Japan no-sell in the middle of the match after Cena took the knee and transitioned the bulldog into the Blue
Thunder Bomb. I quasi-marked for it too. Point is no-selling was rampant through the match, even Punk, who is one of the best sellers in the business,
was underselling. That match is not why wrestling is considered an art form in Japan. That match is actually a good example of how Satoshi Kojima has
nearly killed puro. If you liked the match, brutha, more power to you but I was not as enthralled with the late 70's-esque ringwork.
I have only watched the match once and was going back to watch it today, but was busy. My knee-jerk reaction was that it was boring and never really
found that second gear. I love Ric Flair track meets, good 'ol fashioned work over a body part, and high impact brutal heavyweight contests. My
tastes run the gamut, but for me that match did a whole lotta nothing for me. It was a bunch of different segments shoe-horned together with no glue
between them. I am not even bitching about the over-booked finish (I was expecting and wanting an over-booked finish), when I say that finish was
lukewarm. It seemed like a finish straight out of Lucha Libre, one second the guy is up and the next second that guy was down for the three. It was
jarring and not properly built. Where were all the false finishes? The false finish is one of my favorite hooks in wrestling. That match was sorely
lacking in them.
Of course, the clear argument is that Cena's foot on the ropes signifies the match was prematurely over and therefore they were seeking to
achieve this pre-baked finish. All I have to say that, is I hated the booking. Therefore I can no longer blame the match because that was how it was
structured. So that facet of the booking really torpedoed the match for me.
Steiner Brothers vs Sting & Lex Luger
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Blade
Fella
Posts 385
Registered 12-30-2003 Location Darkest Canada Member Is Offline Mood:
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| posted on 8-16-2011 at 04:58 AM |
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Poor Christian. Just a few months ago he was the focus of the IWC uproar that caught the WWE off-guard, and now that he's finally jobbed
ignominiously out and no one cares anymore.
Of course, the funny thing is this one-sided burial also happened in Orton's feud with Punk, but somehow I doubt Christian's going to get
a chance to make us all forget this with a killer promo in a couple of months. Well, at least he's a two-time champ, and he got his one month to
keep the belt warm this time.
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blackdragon
The Great One 
Posts 3550
Registered 11-9-2003 Member Is Offline Mood: Awesome
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| posted on 8-16-2011 at 02:58 PM |
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Amidst these ten pages of dialogue, one thing is certain. This show was big enough to get both BTR and Blade to post about wrestling. When's
the last time that shit happened?
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JB KING
 
Posts 794
Registered 12-4-2009 Location Oxnard, CA Member Is Offline Mood: Jamming
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| posted on 8-16-2011 at 11:49 PM |
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WHUT DER HAIL?
http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/5843/lolsummerslam.png
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Blade
Fella
Posts 385
Registered 12-30-2003 Location Darkest Canada Member Is Offline Mood:
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| posted on 8-17-2011 at 01:18 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by blackdragon
Amidst these ten pages of dialogue, one thing is certain. This show was big enough to get both BTR and Blade to post about wrestling. When's
the last time that shit happened?
2005, pretty sure? Unless I posted about Eddie dying, can't recall.
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Froggie
Fella
Posts 484
Registered 10-25-2002 Location Bizarro Land, Ontario Member Is Offline Mood: Stylin'
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| posted on 8-17-2011 at 06:57 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Blade
Poor Christian. Just a few months ago he was the focus of the IWC uproar that caught the WWE off-guard, and now that he's finally jobbed
ignominiously out and no one cares anymore.
I still care! WWEs BS treatment of Christian is why I'll no longer watch WWE TV anymore (I watched a few SD!s during his title run but thats
the extent of it). It's mind boggling...they had a babyface that was over with the fans, was (and still is) having great matches everyone up
and down the card, had tons of charisma and was great on the microphone (keep in mind he still has all of these things...people believed so little in
his heel turn they were still chanting his name at SummerSlam). He was bullet-proof...if they built up credible heels and fed them to Christian
one-by-one, there's no way his title run wouldn't have been a success!!
Christian had (and still has) all of the indredients...his only issue is that the idiot promotion he works for didn't believe in him at a time
when he was arguably one of the most over babyfaces in the entire company
***EDIT***
And if they turn him face again he'll be one of the most over babyfaces in the Fed once again!!
[Edited on 8-17-2011 by Froggie]
[Edited on 8-19-2011 by Froggie]
"...Best There Ever Will Be!!"
-When WWE jobbed first time WWE World Heavyweight Champion Christian out to Randy Orton and turned him heel when he (Christian) was arguably the most
over babyface on the roster and having great matches with everyone on the card, it was at that exact moment that WWE jumped the shark!!
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chewey
And I am AWESOME 
Posts 138
Registered 6-17-2008 Location Washington, DC Member Is Offline Mood: Marchie Archie!
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| posted on 8-17-2011 at 07:12 PM |
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By the way, I just read Pyro's Raw recap and got a little laugh from this line.
quote:
If we toss Cena, Punk, and the opener out of the show, the episode was as boring as two turtles considering mating but ultimately deciding to
eat the nearest leaf.
Pyro, are you suggesting that you're into turtle porn? lol.
EDIT: I posted this in the wrong thread, meant to post it in the Raw discussion, sorry!
[Edited on 8-17-2011 by chewey]
"Don't matter how many times you get burnt, you just keep doin' the same."
--Bodie, HBO's The Wire
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