Psycho Penguin
And I am AWESOME 
Posts 108
Registered 6-30-2002 Location Greenacres FL Member Is Offline Mood: No Mood.
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| posted on 2-10-2010 at 03:51 AM |
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I think a proper adult would realize I'm not talking about you since I was talking about people bitching about me and others giving it a 4+ when
you didn't bitch. Therefore I wasn't including you. I was including the posts that bitched. Because they were the negative ones.
And really, if people want Punk to say the same thing on TWO shows every week, well.. I don't know about that. Especially since he seems to get
BURIED!! every time he's on RAW. The only thing it would help with the Society is getting more people to join it, and really, the Society
shouldn't be so big just yet.
And really, if I think an angle is well written, it's well written regardless of who's in it. If I didn't like Cena or DX (which I
don't) and didn't care about how the angles with them were written (which I do), then why the hell even watch the show? DX isn't
going to magically disappear. Taker isn't going to magically stop wrestling. It seems counter productive to complain that DX is in a main angle
just because the person doesn't like them. DX has been main eventing for a long time now, you'd think they would get the hint by now that
it's not going to change no matter how many posts they complain about it.
And that's what I mean about negativity.. fine, these people you refer to like very few people on RAW and don't care where the angles go
because they're not interested. SO WHY ARE THEY WATCHING?
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Chris Is Good517
Posts 7786
Registered 1-10-2002 Location Little Rock, AR Member Is Offline Mood: OMG #1 Poster!
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| posted on 2-10-2010 at 03:56 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by DevilSoprano
But none of those 3 things make it seem like anything...oh wait, I can't say it was an okay show again otherwise Chris will get his
douchepanties in a twist.
I better not reply to this post because otherwise DevSop might try to make an even bigger victim out of himself.
The OOficial 2009 Poster of the Year!
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DevilSoprano
The Rowdy One
Posts 2659
Registered 11-16-2002 Member Is Offline Mood:
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| posted on 2-10-2010 at 03:56 AM |
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We watch because it's wrestling and we want it to get better. This has been asked and answered hundreds of times over the last few years.
It's wrestling and we're wrestling fans. And they always come through with glimmers of hope or bright spots.
Edge's run when he first turned into the Rated R Superstar. Orton's run last year when he was booting McMahons. Punk's current run
as your lord and savior. Cena when he doesn't feel the need to yell. HHH when he cuts just enough smart reference in his promos. The potential
of the future guys like Sheamus, McIntyre, Miz, MVP, etc.
We watch because it should get better and we want to be there when it does. It doesn't change the fact that we might think it's been good
recently.
ETA: Yup, that's me Chris. A total victim. Keep being a douche. It'll get you places. Maybe you'll be even cooler.
[Edited on 2-10-2010 by DevilSoprano]
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Paddlefoot
Posts 690
Registered 1-19-2008 Location Circus Of Gay Member Is Offline Mood: F'd N Da A
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| posted on 2-10-2010 at 04:01 AM |
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Wrestling fans are funny that way. It gets more amusing to complain when WWE actually does something right as opposed to the more usual complaining
about all the things they do wrong.
No major comment on the show from me. Most of what I saw of it was OK to pretty-good, so I'll be kind and give it a 3.5. I could care
less about a post-stroke Bret Hart being a little clumsy or underpowered after a half-decade of not performing. Hell, it's not like he showed up
drunk like Vader did the last time they tried to recycle him, or the viewing the cosmic tragedy of watching a thoroughly ruined Scott Hall be used in
a major TNA angle. I'm just happy that he showed up period, and is being about the first person in a long-time to turn a Vince-centric storyline
into something interesting.
[Edited on 2-10-2010 by Paddlefoot]
When he dies, Till Lindemann will be the coolest ruler of Hell since Bon Scott. Hideous Teutonic
imagery rulez!
The middle of the road is all the usable surface. The extremes of left and right are in the gutters. - Dwight David Eisenhower
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Devineman
And I am AWESOME 
Posts 219
Registered 10-7-2006 Location UK Member Is Offline Mood: Cynical
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| posted on 2-10-2010 at 04:06 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by LuckyLopez
The problem here is that some just don't see it as a match that yielded any real results. Sheamus beat Christian clean. That's notable
purely because Sheamus hasn't gotten a clean win over anyone half way legitimate since his arrival. But Christian himself doesn't have
any more credibility than "midcard champion who has beat relative nobodies for the last year." So Sheamus gained little from it. Having midcarders
beat midcarders is a tough way to get both over. It can happen, especially if they really perform excellently, but the most direct way to get a guy
like Sheamus over on the main event level is to have him beat a main eventer. Thus far WWE has had him skirt by Orton and Cena in the same way Punk
skirted by guys and since Sheamus never beat anyone to get the first title shot we're left with "Who has he beat?" The answer is now
"Christian", which means what? Jack Swagger has also beaten Christian. I think Tommy Dreamer did. Mark Henry probably. Christian himself needs
to gain credibility if he were to rise up the WWE ladder.
To be honest LL, I think that's over analysing it a bit. We're talking about former TNA Champ, current ECW Champ, former Tag Team Champ,
guy who's being in tens of classics, and has been around for ever - guy. To be legitimate, he doesn't need to be beating Shaemus, he has
earn't his legitimacy over the past decade. Just as if another perennial WWE upper midcarder came back, such as Jarrett, the fact that the
crowd knows who he was 5 years ago does give a type of legitimacy.
Obviously, if he is getting pummeled by Hornswoggle every week, then he loses it, but being the ECW Champion does reinforce the fact somewhat that he
is a 'big deal'. Just because we devalue Christian because of that belt, doesn't mean the majority of the WWE audience does, and
surely that's who we are talking about here, as nobody can think that the WWE writes shows for us.
I'm making a bold prediction, that if Sheamus cut his awful hair, he'd be a more legitimate Heavyweight Champ. I challenge you guys to
find me one long term Big Belt holder who didn't have a normal haircut.
quote:
No, it means its up to WWE to MAKE me care but since I have no emotional investment in Dibiase and Rhodes and since they have no established character
then they're starting from scratch. If Dibiase is making a face turn, then the basic truth is I don't care about him enough to be
interested in that.
Yeah, but you have to meet them halfway somewhat. Becoming emotionally invested in the characters isn't as hard if you actually try to care.
Unfortunately, the WWE no longer has the workers or writers to snap the cynic out of people, so the alternatives are to watch a show that you mostly
dislike, or give a little leeway.
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Chris Is Good517
Posts 7786
Registered 1-10-2002 Location Little Rock, AR Member Is Offline Mood: OMG #1 Poster!
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| posted on 2-10-2010 at 04:12 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by DevilSoprano
ETA: Yup, that's me Chris. A total victim.
Yes, we know. You've gone out of your way to repeatedly make that point, too.
Oh, and since you apparently want to be an internet tough guy instead of letting last night go:
-
-
-
http://www.abc.net.au/reslib/200711/r198256_756386.jpg
+
=
Stupid-ass image breaking tables.
[Edited on 2-10-2010 by ModSquad]
The OOficial 2009 Poster of the Year!
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Psycho Penguin
And I am AWESOME
Posts 108
Registered 6-30-2002 Location Greenacres FL Member Is Offline Mood: No Mood.
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| posted on 2-10-2010 at 04:14 AM |
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quote:
I challenge you guys to find me one long term Big Belt holder who didn't have a normal haircut.
Sheamus's hair is red and spiky.. would you like him to dye it and get a buzz cut? I'm not sure what the definition of a
'normal' haircut is here, most of them have been bald like Austin, buzz cuts like Orton and Rock, shorter hair like Flair, stringy hair
like HHH, Punhk, and HBK, or longer hair like Taker, Edge, and Hogan. Sheamus's hairstyle probably doesn't have much to do with his
success as champ. "Oh God, I really would watch that guy get his ass kicked if HE'D JUST CHANGE HIS HAIR!"
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DevilSoprano
The Rowdy One
Posts 2659
Registered 11-16-2002 Member Is Offline Mood:
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| posted on 2-10-2010 at 04:15 AM |
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So I'm supposed to let it go and yet you can be the internet tough guy having to search for pictures of me. That makes sense.
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Chris Is Good517
Posts 7786
Registered 1-10-2002 Location Little Rock, AR Member Is Offline Mood: OMG #1 Poster!
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| posted on 2-10-2010 at 04:16 AM |
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Dude they're not hard to find, they're right there on the Megan's Law website
The OOficial 2009 Poster of the Year!
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Paddlefoot
Posts 690
Registered 1-19-2008 Location Circus Of Gay Member Is Offline Mood: F'd N Da A
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| posted on 2-10-2010 at 04:17 AM |
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When he dies, Till Lindemann will be the coolest ruler of Hell since Bon Scott. Hideous Teutonic
imagery rulez!
The middle of the road is all the usable surface. The extremes of left and right are in the gutters. - Dwight David Eisenhower
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DrBoz
Showstopper
Posts 708
Registered 1-2-2006 Location Indiana Member Is Offline Mood: Crescent Fresh
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| posted on 2-10-2010 at 04:41 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Paddlefoot
Totally awesome pic
That is like the best picture I've seen in the 11:00 hour in the past four days!
"I guess my heaviest experience is gravity...keeps my feet down...it's like weighing me down...I can't get my arms up now...like my legs
fall...I'm falling down and I can't...it's making me heavier...I'm heavier...I can't move...Now I'm a dead dog in
water...I can't...I'm floating but I sink to the water...I'm a wet sandwich...wet with meat...I'm broken salami...tiny
mustaches are heavy...I'm falling...."
- Chester from Sifl and Olly
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Devineman
And I am AWESOME
Posts 219
Registered 10-7-2006 Location UK Member Is Offline Mood: Cynical
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| posted on 2-10-2010 at 04:43 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Psycho Penguin
Sheamus's hair is red and spiky.. would you like him to dye it and get a buzz cut? I'm not sure what the definition of a
'normal' haircut is here, most of them have been bald like Austin, buzz cuts like Orton and Rock, shorter hair like Flair, stringy hair
like HHH, Punhk, and HBK, or longer hair like Taker, Edge, and Hogan. Sheamus's hairstyle probably doesn't have much to do with his
success as champ. "Oh God, I really would watch that guy get his ass kicked if HE'D JUST CHANGE HIS HAIR!"
Sorry, that was tongue in cheek. I need to work on pumping up my mad forum skillz
[Edited on 10-2-10 by Devineman]
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LuckyLopez
Reeks of WCW 
Posts 11345
Registered 2-13-2003 Member Is Offline Mood:
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| posted on 2-10-2010 at 05:15 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Devineman
To be honest LL, I think that's over analysing it a bit. We're talking about former TNA Champ, current ECW Champ, former Tag Team Champ,
guy who's being in tens of classics, and has been around for ever - guy. To be legitimate, he doesn't need to be beating Shaemus, he has
earn't his legitimacy over the past decade. Just as if another perennial WWE upper midcarder came back, such as Jarrett, the fact that the
crowd knows who he was 5 years ago does give a type of legitimacy.
Obviously, if he is getting pummeled by Hornswoggle every week, then he loses it, but being the ECW Champion does reinforce the fact somewhat that he
is a 'big deal'. Just because we devalue Christian because of that belt, doesn't mean the majority of the WWE audience does, and
surely that's who we are talking about here, as nobody can think that the WWE writes shows for us.
Problem is WWE doesn't treat people like that. Is R-Truth the first black NWA World Champion, a title Ron Killings won twice? Hell, is he a 2
time WWF Hardcore champion like K-Kwik was? Lets face it, in WWE's world Christian is NOT a former World Champion, because even if they
acknowledged TNA's existence or a world outside WWE they certainly wouldn't pay respect to another championship. For better or worse, WWE
insulates itself from the rest of the wrestling world so while we might see Bryan Danielson and Low Ki world traveled stars and former champions who
have proven themselves they'll probably debut as rookies on the bottom rung.
Christian's stock is basically determined by how he's booked. And Christian's a champion and wins a bunch, which is good, but he
beats people of no consequence on a show seen by less people than Superstars or Impact. He holds a title that may well get retired in 2 weeks for no
other reason than WWE has no use for it. So on the grand scheme of things, does Sheamus beating Christian mean he beat the 2-time TNA World Champion
or the ECW Champion? Because this is all make believe and Sheamus didn't REALLY beat Christian. WWE just booked him to. So wouldn't it
actually be kind of silly to say Sheamus gained the credibility of beating a World Champion Christian Cage when WWE doesn't regard him as such?
Ultimately aren't we talking about values determined almost elusively by arbitrary standards created by WWE?
And the guy WWE clearly has cast Christian as is the champion who rarely makes a PPV defense, whose challengers are entirely rookies and journeymen,
and whose king of a little kingdom that is being shut down in 2 weeks because its deemed less important than Superstars and a reality show.
So I could say "I think really highly of Christian so Sheamus beating him means more to me than I believe it means to WWE" but wouldn't that
just be silly since Sheamus didn't actually do anything but what the script dictated?
quote:
Yeah, but you have to meet them halfway somewhat. Becoming emotionally invested in the characters isn't as hard if you actually try to
care. Unfortunately, the WWE no longer has the workers or writers to snap the cynic out of people, so the alternatives are to watch a show that you
mostly dislike, or give a little leeway.
Who says people aren't trying to care? Dev listed off a bunch of recent things he cared about. I mentioned the night the crowd was chanting
for Cody Rhodes and if you go back you'll see that night I cared about Rhodes for the first and only time since I first saw him and was just
interested in a prospect because of his name. I'm sure some people have written them off entirely but the simple fact that I don't care
about Legacy doesn't mean I don't want to or am unwilling to. I just need an actual reason, and by that not "well, WWE feels like
pushing them now" but rather "they've shown they're talented or interesting enough to deserve to be cared about."
I'll give you a good example in Kofi Kingston. WWE really has tried with Kofi. I give them credit. Maybe not a perfect push, maybe we can
argue over mistakes made, but its undeniable that they gave him opportunities to shine and look good, and he picked up clean wins over guys higher on
the ladder than Christian. The night he trashed Orton's car and cut a promo people got really excited for him. Personally Kofi didn't
really do it for me as he's never really done it for me, but I recognize that's a purely subjective opinion. I do see what he and WWE did
and recognize why others responded more positively to him. I personally haven't been won over by the guy but its not because I haven't
wanted to be and its not for a lack of effort on WWE's part.
Or about CM Punk, who 3 years ago I never thought would be a World Champion or would be doing this heel character. He's reached heights in WWE
that the cynic in me never could have imagined.
Or what about Miz and Morrison? Or those times "we" the collective cynics of the internet didn't hate Cena, Batista, or Orton but actually
cheered them as some of the best parts of wrestling? Jerishow? "We" are not impossible to please. "We" are not unwilling to enjoy something and
admit it when we do. Its weird that I and others are disappointed by the tag title change because "we" wanted a 3 time World Champion currently
getting a clear push to win the titles, but in expressing our disappointment "we're" basically being portrayed in the same petulant and
unrealistic smark role "we" always are. But we weren't sitting here hoping for something silly and smarky. We were hoping for a perfectly
reasonable thing involving one of WWE's key performers. It wasn't some fantasy booked Evan Bourne push.
So I don't see the problem as "we" aren't willing to care about Legacy. Because I don't see anyone saying WHY I should care about
Legacy. I don't see what it is that Dibiase or Rhodes did that "should" have fired me up about them in the same way I can see what fires
people up about Kofi, Miz, Morrison, Punk, Swagger, MVP, Bourne, etc. Dibiase beat Mark Henry, a fairly unspectacular feat. Then he expressed some
mild backbone against Orton. Then (if I remember correctly) he was more or less squashed by Cena. Rhodes picked up a fluke win over Orton when
Sheamus interfered. Its a solid enough story on paper but am I "wrong" for not getting any emotion behind it? If I didn't care about Dibiase
2 weeks ago (and to be honest, is there a reason I should have?) what greater reason do I have to care about him this week? What breakout promo,
match, gimmick, or story did I miss?
[Edited on 2-10-2010 by LuckyLopez]
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FistHiccups
Showstopper
Posts 962
Registered 6-27-2007 Member Is Offline Mood:
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| posted on 2-10-2010 at 11:52 AM |
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Reading Lucky's post, I just remembered my favourite part of Raw. It was when Christian said "We were both born without last names."
Sometimes, Christian reminds me why I used to think he was so awesome five years ago.
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DrBoz
Showstopper
Posts 708
Registered 1-2-2006 Location Indiana Member Is Offline Mood: Crescent Fresh
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| posted on 2-10-2010 at 12:28 PM |
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See, that's what baffles me about the way they handle Christian in the WWE. The crowd always seems to love him. He's EXCELLENT on the
mike. He's just fine in the ring. He's not the biggest guy in the world, but I'm guessing he's probably about the size of
HBK. I've never really understood how Edge ascended so high while Christian lingers somewhere in the middle. I don't really see
Christian as the Janetty of E&C;, or at least I don't see him lacking anything that would label him as such. Maybe Edge has more of an "edge"
than Christian. I dunno.
"I guess my heaviest experience is gravity...keeps my feet down...it's like weighing me down...I can't get my arms up now...like my legs
fall...I'm falling down and I can't...it's making me heavier...I'm heavier...I can't move...Now I'm a dead dog in
water...I can't...I'm floating but I sink to the water...I'm a wet sandwich...wet with meat...I'm broken salami...tiny
mustaches are heavy...I'm falling...."
- Chester from Sifl and Olly
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ModSquad
The Online Onslaught 'Gustapo'
Posts 3386
Registered 1-30-2003 Member Is Offline Mood: Adminty
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| posted on 2-10-2010 at 12:48 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Chris Is Good517
You're burning someone else while showing that posting on the same board with the same image rules for almost HALF A DECADE is something
too hard to remember. I'd make a joke about how you have children younger than the rule about posting wide-ass pictures that wreck the board
tables, but apparently you can't go more than 10 months without knocking up your wife again.
THOSE AREN'T BALLOONS. THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO GO ON YOUR DICK.
"The moment that The Rick tells me that I am in the wrong then I will stop. And since I have 10 years of reading his work under my belt I feel fairly
confident that he won't since he is a proponent of thinking differently. Save the threats."
Hot Tip: If the moderators tell you to do something, ask them how long they've been reading The Rick. If you've even got a week on
them, guess who knows better? It's you, superstar. It's you.
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Psycho Penguin
And I am AWESOME
Posts 108
Registered 6-30-2002 Location Greenacres FL Member Is Offline Mood: No Mood.
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| posted on 2-10-2010 at 03:39 PM |
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It's a credible win if the fans buy into Christian as a legit wrestler, and they do. He may not have the credibility of a Punk or Jericho, but
it's at least as good as beating a Kane or Morrison. So what if the WWE doesn't come out and say he's a former world champ? Some
people do know he is, he's over, he always has good matches, and he just has something credible to him even if the WWE refuses to acknowledge
it. It's a similar boat to what Edge was in before 2006. I even think beating R-Truth would beat a credible win for Sheamus. (btw, they
haven't mentioned the hardcore title since it was retired so that's a silly example =P) Yes, they should have had him beating midcarders
like Christian and Truth BEFORE December, but at least he might start doing it now.
[Edited on 2-10-2010 by Psycho Penguin]
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Paddlefoot
Posts 690
Registered 1-19-2008 Location Circus Of Gay Member Is Offline Mood: F'd N Da A
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| posted on 2-10-2010 at 05:24 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by DrBoz
See, that's what baffles me about the way they handle Christian in the WWE. The crowd always seems to love him. He's EXCELLENT on the
mike. He's just fine in the ring. He's not the biggest guy in the world, but I'm guessing he's probably about the size of
HBK. I've never really understood how Edge ascended so high while Christian lingers somewhere in the middle. I don't really see
Christian as the Janetty of E&C;, or at least I don't see him lacking anything that would label him as such. Maybe Edge has more of an "edge"
than Christian. I dunno.
As he spent a significant amount of time as another company's A-list champ, Christian probably has to go through some obligatory ritual of
deconstruction first before he'll be taken seriously on the "serious" WWE shows, i.e. the two shows that weren't ECW. Losing out to
Seamus is one thing, as Seamus is a major champ and should be beating up lots of guys like Christian all the time. When Christian starts losing out to
the R-Truth's or Ziggler's of the scene, and gets firmly re-positioned out of the main title circuit we'll know for certain that,
outside of being a champ on their former C-level show, he's probably arrived at where WWE wants him to be.
Such is the cost of exchanging main-eventer status in TNA for a bigger and more reliable pay schedule in WWE. You have to do what the boss tells you
even if it runs against the grain of what a significant amount of fans actually want to see happen. And it could be worse for him. He'll still
be in US/IC/tag titles territory for the foreseeable future. And it's not like he got the Gail Kim treatment with zero promo time or being used
as enhancement personnel for random Kelly Kelly or Eve Torres pushes.
[Edited on 2-10-2010 by Paddlefoot]
When he dies, Till Lindemann will be the coolest ruler of Hell since Bon Scott. Hideous Teutonic
imagery rulez!
The middle of the road is all the usable surface. The extremes of left and right are in the gutters. - Dwight David Eisenhower
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FistHiccups
Showstopper
Posts 962
Registered 6-27-2007 Member Is Offline Mood:
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| posted on 2-10-2010 at 05:41 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by DrBoz
See, that's what baffles me about the way they handle Christian in the WWE. The crowd always seems to love him. He's EXCELLENT on the
mike. He's just fine in the ring. He's not the biggest guy in the world, but I'm guessing he's probably about the size of
HBK. I've never really understood how Edge ascended so high while Christian lingers somewhere in the middle. I don't really see
Christian as the Janetty of E&C;, or at least I don't see him lacking anything that would label him as such. Maybe Edge has more of an "edge"
than Christian. I dunno.
I haven't thought much of him since he came back a year ago. He looks really frail, and he has this horrible habit of clapping all the time like
he's wrestling on the kind of "All-Star American Wrestling" show that tours mid-sized theatres here. I don't know what it is, but he
just hasn't seemed as ready for the world title elevation this time round.
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DevilSoprano
The Rowdy One
Posts 2659
Registered 11-16-2002 Member Is Offline Mood:
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| posted on 2-10-2010 at 06:42 PM |
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It's called mailing it in. He's going through the motions. Putting on solid matches, cutting solid promos, but in no way, shape, or form
going above and beyond to reach the levels he was at when he left WWE the first time and his entire TNA run.
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Psycho Penguin
And I am AWESOME
Posts 108
Registered 6-30-2002 Location Greenacres FL Member Is Offline Mood: No Mood.
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| posted on 2-10-2010 at 07:02 PM |
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quote:
Such is the cost of exchanging main-eventer status in TNA for a bigger and more reliable pay schedule in WWE. You have to do what the boss tells you
even if it runs against the grain of what a significant amount of fans actually want to see happen. And it could be worse for him. He'll still
be in US/IC/tag titles territory for the foreseeable future. And it's not like he got the Gail Kim treatment with zero promo time or being used
as enhancement personnel for random Kelly Kelly or Eve Torres pushes.
1. They haven't done anything with him yet except give him a title belt for the last eight months or so.
2. No one has left a main event spot in TNA to go to WWE so this is not an indicator of anything one way or the other. You need to have actual data
over the course of several years to come up with a hypothesis about that, not 'hey Christian might not be a main eventer in six months, this is
how it is!'
3. There is no reason to assume he'll not be main eventing when I can easily assume he will be judging by the fact he's pushed as a bigger
deal than guys like Morrison (former ECW champ too!) and Swagger (also!)
Congrats on a lame argument.
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LuckyLopez
Reeks of WCW
Posts 11345
Registered 2-13-2003 Member Is Offline Mood:
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| posted on 2-10-2010 at 07:34 PM |
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I doubt it helps Christian's case that he's been tossed to the C Show to wrestle green and unover rookies and well past their prime
journeymen.
quote:
Originally posted by Psycho Penguin
It's a credible win if the fans buy into Christian as a legit wrestler, and they do. He may not have the credibility of a Punk or Jericho, but
it's at least as good as beating a Kane or Morrison. So what if the WWE doesn't come out and say he's a former world champ? Some
people do know he is, he's over, he always has good matches, and he just has something credible to him even if the WWE refuses to acknowledge
it. It's a similar boat to what Edge was in before 2006. I even think beating R-Truth would beat a credible win for Sheamus. (btw, they
haven't mentioned the hardcore title since it was retired so that's a silly example =P) Yes, they should have had him beating midcarders
like Christian and Truth BEFORE December, but at least he might start doing it now.
I guess it comes down to my opinion that Sheamus needs a hell of a lot more than wins over the likes of Morrison, R-Truth (who I wouldn't put
any higher than someone like MVP who Sheamus has beat), or Christian (who I'm not sure I'd put above Morrison). As you said, these wins
would have been important in December but booking Sheamus the way they have he's skipped right past the "make look legitimate" phase. Now
he's champion and now proving him a legitimate midcarder is completely pointless. The need is to prove him a legitimate main eventer, and
beating Christian, Morrison, or Truth does nothing to get us there. There's only one way to legitimize Sheamus as a member of that top shelf
and it NOT by booking him with guys not on that top shelf.
Basically Sheamus pinning Christian feels like the very problem. WWE doesn't seem to want to give Sheamus a win over a main eventer, so
Christian gets pinned. But the only reason Christian is getting pinned is because he's less important than the guys WWE is trying to protect.
And if Sheamus can't pin main eventers then he shouldn't have the damn #1 belt in the company.
quote:
Originally posted by Psycho Penguin
3. There is no reason to assume he'll not be main eventing when I can easily assume he will be judging by the fact he's pushed as a bigger
deal than guys like Morrison (former ECW champ too!) and Swagger (also!)
Congrats on a lame argument.
By what basis are you seeing "Christian > Morrison"? I mean, I can maybe see it but you're presenting it as fact so I'm curious.
Morrison's W-L record is less of late than Christian's but he's a recent midcard champion (just like Christian), on a higher rated
and higher regarded TV show, who has picked up wins over main eventers and world champions like CM Punk, and who is set to compete in the Elimination
Chamber match for the World Title on a PPV where Christian is not yet scheduled for, unlikely to be scheduled based on being "ECW Champion" since
the ECW championships is commonly skipped, and may not even be ECW Champion by then because the belt may not exist or he might have lost it to the
high ranking Ezekiel Jackson.
Personally I think ranking guys on a booking sheet is really hard and pretty arbitrary but I do question how you so confidently see Christian over
Morrison when I'm pretty sure I'd put Morrison over Christian.
Otherwise, while I'd agree that there's little evidence to support a theory that TNA main eventers get depushed in WWE there is evidence
to suggest that former TNA champions and stars start from the bottom with little to no acknowledgment of their TNA accomplishments (Marcus Cor Von;
Braden Walker; R-Truth) and there's a long history of theory about WCW and ECW stars (Goldberg; Booker T; Rob Van Dam; Nash; Scott Steiner) also
experiencing similar struggles (post Monday Night Wars) finding success in WWE until they had been sufficiently "remade" or just for short flashes.
So its not exactly a baseless theory to argue that a wrestler who achieved notable success in ANY national competitor to WWE experiences hurdles to
duplicate that success in WWE.
quote:
Originally posted by Psycho Penguin
They haven't done anything with him yet
If you'll excuse my creative editing, I think THIS is the truly relevant point about Christian that will leave many of us either scratching our
heads or doubting WWE's intentions when 14 months or so ago I thought Christian was the single most valuable performer in wrestling who had
spent the last 2 or 3 years making everything he touched better and consistently entertaining audiences regardless of how he was used or where he was
booked. And on today, the exact 1 year anniversary of Christian's return to WWE the highlight of his tenure is carrying Zach Ryder to the best
match of his career.
[Edited on 2-10-2010 by LuckyLopez]
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Psycho Penguin
And I am AWESOME
Posts 108
Registered 6-30-2002 Location Greenacres FL Member Is Offline Mood: No Mood.
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| posted on 2-10-2010 at 08:21 PM |
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quote:
Personally I think ranking guys on a booking sheet is really hard and pretty arbitrary but I do question how you so confidently see Christian over
Morrison when I'm pretty sure I'd put Morrison over Christian.
You're saying Christian hasn't done anything but beat rookies and young guys.. well Morrison just spent the last few months feuding with
Ziggler then losing every match to McIntyre. He also lost to Miz at Bragging Rights and Survivor Series. How does Morrison have more credibility than
Christian right now?
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DevilSoprano
The Rowdy One
Posts 2659
Registered 11-16-2002 Member Is Offline Mood:
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| posted on 2-10-2010 at 08:43 PM |
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Because Morrison has competed with and beaten guys like Punk and Jericho, both former World Champs while Christian is slumming it with Zach Ryder and
Ezekial Jackson.
Morrison is clearly treated as superior to Christian in the WWE Universe.
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LuckyLopez
Reeks of WCW
Posts 11345
Registered 2-13-2003 Member Is Offline Mood:
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| posted on 2-10-2010 at 08:47 PM |
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Basically over the last 6 months or so the most I can remember Christian having done is beat Regal, Jackson, Kozlov, Ryder, Yoshi, Benjamin, or
whatever other low level and completely insignificant challengers came along, including guys like Swagger and Dreamer who have moved on to do such
illustrious things as lose to Santino and get released. And these defenses typically appear not on PPV but rather on the lowest of 4 rated WWE
programs and lower than Impact.
While in that time I can remember Morrison having a cross brand feud with Miz, picking up wins over guys like Rey Mysterio and CM Punk while competing
head-to-head with someone like Chris Jericho, get a World Title match vs Jeff Hardy, and make more PPV appearances. And while his recent W-L record
seems to pale in comparison to Punk's he's currently one of 5 challengers for the World Heavyweight title, which he became by beating
McIntyre for once. And of course this is all happening on a more important and more watched brand.
[Edited on 2-10-2010 by LuckyLopez]
[Edited on 2-10-2010 by LuckyLopez]
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